Michas Scoble"Mr. Alexander, let's go back to those far been times when you've just entered the literature. At first all went the usual way — the first publication, the first encouraging words of critics. By the way, you are immediately made their debut in "Flame" that with the newcomers happened very rarely. "
Ales Nawrocki"This is indeed a rare case. Maybe it was because I just zaatakavav "Flame" for his poems. Several times sent their works to the editor, and its employees, apparently tired of giving negative answers. Therefore decided to admit me to the "Polymya."
Scoble"Your first book" Heaven smiles lightning "was published in 1962 and caused the whole attack on you. A book editor Basil Trinity was even fired from the publisher. Vzgarevsya why the fuss? "
Nawrocki"I think so. It is necessary at all to the literary life was in full swing — that there were some disputes have been agreement and disagreement. My first collection of some stood out among the others. There was also something to praise, and for something to criticize. Therefore, there was, as you say, the fuss. There was not a political reason to cling to, but zachapitststsa found the way. "
Scoble"But whom it had and why?"
Nawrocki"Nobody should have. But if you stand in the literary life of the swamp, it's bad for literature, and for the government. Swamp be infringed. There must be peace and quiet. "
Scoble"And yet, in your book, for which he was seriously hooked and the critics and censors. I quote: "He spoke from the podium once Nose: feed units, corn, oats … They say the facts that we catch up …" And in the yard — in 1962, Khrushchev was in power, and he is known to those of your lines. "
Nawrocki"I did not set such a goal — to show Khrushchev, paint it in a caricature. But as soon as I wrote this poem, he felt that Khrushchev turned. And all too soon it saw. So sometimes it is — the writer writes himself is not exactly what can happen. At the time of writing can jump out and Khrushchev. "
Scoble"But as it passed through censorship? While all the books go through a thorough inspection of censorship. "
Nawrocki"Maybe I contributed to the editor Basil Trinity. I do not rule out this. Apparently, he liked the poem. In general, there is nothing wrong was because I did not show the finger at Khrushchev. And could you mentioned lines and understand this: just the head of the floor, and what rank he — is not clear. "
Scoble"There were in your collection and anti-Stalinist poetry. As you approached the subject of Stalin? "
Nawrocki"As soon as I found out that Stalin — a tyrant who killed people, when the kind of freedom to talk about it, I was opposed to it. I realized that Stalin — the greatest tyrant of them all, which only existed in the history of mankind. And if Stalin — the tyrant, the tyrant of the poet is obliged to take the ear but in the sun. Today, I am surprised how my poems were in print. Maybe because the wave of anti-Stalinist just gaining momentum. "
Scoble"And when did you first notice the attention to himself by the KGB?"
Nawrocki"The first time I felt this attention when a doctor in a rural hospital. This Hoinikskii district, the village Arabia. Once a rural paramedic asked me to make fake documents for his wife. And I suspect that this is not it offers, and through it offers. I felt that I was — under the hood, and if so, it can not be that the case had continued. I was already wary. A truly hounding me and mental intimidation began when I was in a writing course in Moscow in 1975. I was forced to apply to the Rector and to stop their studies. He arrived in Minsk and started thinking about how I get out of this situation. I decided to write this story. It was only after a written, I went to the Central Committee of the PBC and filed a protest letter addressed to Masherova. In that letter, I described what I am haunted by the KGB, and that I have no life. "
Scoble"And what was the reaction Masherova?"
Nawrocki: "I could not talk to himself Masherov, I talked with Sergei Zakonnikova, which at the time was head of the department of literature. I handed him the letter. My case, I'm sure, came up to Masherova. I remember I was still thinking that maybe this way I want to make travel abroad. I reasoned that it would be better as well. In the courtyard stands the black night of fascism under Brezhnev, I do not want to print. I wrote a request to the KGB at the checkout. I was called back and said for going right invitation from relatives abroad. So just let me out, they can not. KGB was not interested, so I went and started talking on Radio Liberty truth about the Soviet Union. I saw that I would have to go, do not give me the job. "
Scoble"And did you try to print at the time?"
Nawrocki"I handed over four times in publishing his book of short stories, and each time it was rejected. In addition, while in protest I came out of the Writers' Union. So what about the press and of speech could not be. I have already given up on this thing. "
Scoble"Who recommended you for joining the Union, remember?"
Nawrocki"Why not? Petrus Hinge, Vladimir Karatkevich and Anatoly Klyshko. "
Scoble"You mentioned Karatkevich, and I remembered his story about you and vigilant poetic vision and keen hearing of the poet Nawrocki. Karatkevich called you highly original poet, who went from yourself. "
Nawrocki"In the beginning I was dependent on the creativity of all. First — from Mayakovsky. And Mayakovsky took origin from Khlebnikov, and after Mayakovsky were, say, Semyon Kirsanov and Andrei Voznesensky. Then I realized that something that is unpleasant, too much art. It should be easy to write. The biggest test for the poet — a test simplicity. How to write simple poems in ordinary language such as: "The wind is blowing, warm month"? It would seem, so what? And this is the hardest thing can be in poetry. So I decided to go to the poetry of yourself. "
Scoble"Those literary courses in Moscow, which you mentioned, they will give anything a writer? You have learned something there? "
Nawrocki"Oh, and learned! I believe this: how big nor had the talent, but it is very important to pass litnavuku. At least one year to learn! At the writer, usually seen as a man who knows everything, but in fact he may not know the most ordinary things. And so it is necessary to learn. Literature courses have gone for me. You could say that I vyspelivsya as a writer on those courses. I remember there before us were Valentin Rasputin, Yevgeny Yevtushenko. Knowing that he — not only poetry, but also a historical figure, I took a notebook, pencil and recorded t
hat meeting … Since I studied a great writer, a writer of world scale, novelist Vladimir Lichutsin. It can be placed next to such Russian classics as Leskov. Even today, I am following my classmates, I read all of it that catches your eye. And read made me very impressed. "
Scoble"Either you are reading current literature? Do you like who among the young? "
Nawrocki"I have to look closely to how writes Anatoly Sys. He is believed to have our classic, but I have this impression did not happen. However, I have only read one of his collection — "Pan Forest." In my opinion, the height of Maxim Bogdanovich none of the modern Belarusian poets not reached. It is a pity that the writers in Belarus is divided into two camps. But I think because all that is connected with literary organization can not remain without attention of the president. The split of the Union of Writers — political action, not just some needle fell to the floor. For all the power is closely monitoring. "
Scoble"And if you have decided to return to the ranks of the writers' organization, in which of the two unions?"
Nawrocki"Of course, I am more inclined to the Union of Belarusian Writers. There are people I know for whom the Belarusian language — the basis of life. "
Scoble"I know that you have this year appealed to the Ministry of Culture and the State Security Committee, demanding political rehabilitation and received a response. What's in it? "
Nawrocki"I received a letter signed by the chairman of the KGB Zaitseva, posted on October 22. I quote: "The State Security Committee under the purview held Checking incoming treatment. Involvement of the KGB to set the event is not confirmed." My comment to this letter is: KGB knows my business, I could call and the staff that it had a relationship. By and large, it was the KGB and must state that he is unleashed on me the doctors who diagnosed me. Letter from the Committee for State Security — is an evasion, and that I can not take unsubscribe. I declare the protest KGB and still hope that maybe the president will hear my voice, hear the minister of culture, and I'll get rehabilitation. If the KGB maintains his position, means — bullying continues, and he has no end in sight. "
"Nawrocki — the standard of literary perfection"
Despite many years of silence, in Ales Nawrocki is a lot of supporters. I asked to speak at the "House of Writers," the writer and publisher of Constantine Tsvirko, literary historian and poet Anatoly Sidorevich Nicholas Kostyukevich.
Constantine Tsvirko"When the first collection of Ales Nawrocki" Heaven smiles by lightning, "he noticed everything. It was a new, fresh breeze in the literature. What is the book we are particularly captured? We lived and grew up in the Soviet system, under the cover of socialist realism. Already established a certain style of Soviet poetry and understanding of what is necessary, and what not to write. And here comes a collection of Nawrocki, where it says: "We lived on the bread without bread." We talk about it still could not, as he said. I remember many of the poems, such as "svezhevystruganny board." It would seem that you can write on the board? A Nawrocki and the board saw the real poetry, "Every speck adgablyavala sawing, small circles defined course. Classified live your every vein I'm ready to drink like honey!" It's a miracle! I remember we were sitting with Anatoly Klyshko in a public garden and read a collection Nawrocki. With such a sight reading to see what it can be discarded as unworthy. Read, re-read — nothing great collection. Nawrocki — our great poet, the estimated time. I think descendants still appreciate it. However, we must give him. I want to offer Ales Nawrocki give him that in the classic series "Logos." Nawrocki — the pride of our literature. "
Anatoly Sidorevich"It works Ales Nawrocki was way out of the poetics of socialist realism. As much as I praise poetry Gennady Buraukin or Baradulin Gregory, I have to say that in ideological terms, they were dabranadeynyya. For example, Grigory wrote about ordinary filyankovyya like Lenin, doors … A Nawrocki, Nicholas Kupreev even did Michael Sagittarius destroying the aesthetics of socialist realism. Namely, in the poetry of departure from socialist realism seen before in prose. Nawrocki appreciated Yanka Bryl, which Masherov once said, "He does not take our system." And Sagittarius Nawrocki appreciated and Ales Ryazanov, I know appreciates.
And another important point. Ales Nawrocki did not have to readjust to the new time. Many of our poets were rebuilt, and many are ready to give up many of his works. For many, the complete works will be a punishment of God. But I'm not sure what to Ales Nawrocki complete works would be some reproach. As for Michael Leonovich Streltsova. As for the correspondence Nawrocki with the KGB … He was very correct and the correct answer. Why the State Security Committee to leave footprints? After all, you can meet with the head of the medical institution in the appropriate way to talk to him … And — that there's no trace, no documents to you. That's when the diagnosis was confirmed by the court, and the person declared incompetent, and then we would have to cancel the judgment … Here the question would arise about any compensation, what kind of rehabilitation. "
Nicholas Kostyukevich"Last name Nawrocki for lovers and connoisseurs of poetry — the standard of perfection. Without a doubt and reservations. Dispute this thesis can be only two cases — either out of envy (remember how Vysotsky: "By a little, you're a genius, I suppose we are not stupid"), or have to be deaf to the poetic words at all. We do not argue, good or weak, Mandelstam's poems in, say, or Akhmatova. We either love them and appreciate, or nothing tsyamim in poetry.
There is poetry and poetry. Poems written all. Poetry is not always true. And the few who like to Nawrocki. Paradoxical simplicity, if spatykaessya on the most common sentences and words and feel the aches start — here it is, the one now … What may zimitavats, but can not be faked. It's either there or it is not. In Nawrocki is. This, if you like, sacred Belarus. In that sense, if beloruschinu be understood as potentially possible analogue of the Kingdom of God on earth …
I remember when I got into the hands of the poet's prose in Russian, as well as something all stopped — I could read. And it was not fear of running into a weak or false. Rather, a sense of some neabavyazkovastsi. As the temporal and the eternal. Tried the power of the engine in the wrong, others afterburner, was convinced of the reliability and — again on its sacred pillar belarushchyny. In his tireless front of her responsibility. A liability under constant and especially the current survival is unthinkable. And in front of him, and a parade of the word, before God … Let's remembe
r how we all who live, or at least tends to belarushchyny, are often faced with her involuntary profanity and defamation. It would seem to be easy: to strive for it, uzvyshaysya not dropwise cheapness and dirt. And doing bad or ugly — if silent, not prykryvaysya Belarusian, not to spit on it together with you … In this section of the poet and the man Ales Nawrocki gives us a decent sample of high not only creative, but also metaphysical bytstsevay-perfection. His long-standing tacit falling out of the humdrum of the literary society — it's also something that a person is either there or not. First, it is extremely refined artistic taste, and secondly, a common conscience is pure soul and deeds a person who knows the price of real values. It is better to starve to unattainable heights, occasionally pouring out genuine creative gold than with the crib daily passions merge aprykruyu banal … Ales Nawrocki — this is a real person and a genuine creator, for which there will be no awkward reader, nor God, nor the Belarusian subjects. "