Almost three months, the Ministry of Culture was considered the appeal of the Belarusian society volunteer protection of monuments of history and culture of giving the status of historical and cultural values of white-red-white flag. Met the scientific advisory board, was official correspondence between the Ministry and the State Academy. And in the end the decision — to give up. Details of the case we are discussing with the chairman of the society Anton ASTAPOVICH.
Michas Scoble"Anton, you’re heading the Society for Protection of Monuments of History and Culture. Realizing all historical and sacred significance of the white-red-white flag, still call it a monument hardly necessary. Why did you decide to apply to the Ministry of Culture to that initiative?"
Anton Astapovich"In accordance with our legislation, there are real and intangible values.
The exciting thing about that coat Chase since 1995 and included in the list of Municipal nemataryyalnyh historical and cultural heritage of the Republic of Belarus. So I took the initiative — to declare such a value and a white-red-white flag. In the year of the 90th anniversary of the Belarusian People’s Republic, it would have been handy. That’s why I sent a letter to the appropriate Ministry of Culture. And not so long ago got a negative response. "
Scoble"The reaction of the Ministry of Culture was predictable. And yet — as motivation sounded official denial?"
Astapovich"Official motivation is as follows: in-1-x, the question has not been studied, and in-2, the documents have been filed with violations of the legal framework.’s In front of me is an excerpt from the Law on the protection of historical and cultural heritage, the extract from the provisions of on the procedure of the municipal list of historical and cultural values. These documents have been approved by Council of Ministers. But my materials for you who went to the Ministry of Culture. Comparing them, we can say: all laws are made by me. "
Scoble"Deputy Minister of Culture Gridiushko before the" reject the proposal to grant the status of historical and cultural values of white-red-white flag, "refers to the proper conclusions made in the Academic Institute of Arts, Ethnography and Folklore. What do you mean? "
Astapovich"In 1-x, in the Republic of Belarus is the Ministry of Justice, which makes legal analysis of all documents. This is not the competence of the Institute of Arts, Ethnography and Folklore and its directors sovereign Lokotko. And if he makes a legal assessment of my actions, it should be carefully read Regulation on the procedure of the Municipal list of historical and cultural values and Article 20 of the Law on the protection of historical and cultural heritage.
I’ll say it again: all the legal requirements in the documents submitted to the Ministry of Culture have been met. And if sovereign Lokotko refers to regulations that apply to the real historical and cultural values (and here refers to the intangible), it shows that he — legally uneducated man. Although it is a corresponding member of the National Academy. "
Scoble"I think that the sovereign Lokotko still understand the difference between real and intangible value. You have already mentioned that the list included the municipal coat of arms Chase. I just clarify under which cipher — 73BL000004. Why flag that five hundred years, which in After all, is the municipal flag of the Republic of Belarus, does not deserve such respect from the business of the country? "
Astapovich"Here I must clarify. Himself white-red-white flag, to which we are accustomed to, it does not have 500 years. White-red-white color combination in the Belarusian heraldry and symbolism, indeed, above five hundred years.
White-red-white flag as a sign formed in the early 20 century. And this is a common phenomenon, as in European countries, all national heraldic symbols also formed during the uprising of the state. Even the eminent French tricolor only appeared during the French Revolution in the late 18th century. German flag appeared during the creation of a German Chancellor Bismarck in the country.
So that the Belarusian national white-red-white flag was a corresponding historical development. And that is why he does not deserve a place in the list of historical and cultural values, as it is written in the decision of the Belarusian Republican scientific-methodological council on the historical and cultural heritage of the Ministry of Culture, it is not entirely clear. After all, really, just that it from 1991 to 1995 is the municipal flag of the Republic of Belarus, allows rightfully include it in the designated list.
In my opinion, it is totally inadequate solution of scientific and methodological council. I must say that during the last 2-3 years, the Council accepts inadequate solutions to all historical and cultural values, ignoring the existing legal framework and international techniques. It is not in vain in the people began to refer to "the scientific and methodological betrayal."
Scoble"The uncertainty of the status of white-red-white flag from time to time lead to unpredictable situations. I remember the funeral of Vasil Bykov. Then all seemed to be going according to authorities scenario, until a white-red-white flag, which covered Bykov. I remember as Nicholas Cherginets ran for the House of Writers and every now and then to turn to the Belarusian Writers’ Union: "Remove the flag!"
Not removed. And it so happened that specifically white-red-white flag was evicted from the House of Writers and all municipal funeral committee headed by the former Minister of Culture of revelers and a company of soldier headed by Colonel … Indeed, as it turned out, a municipal employee can not be under this flag. Would not it be part of the authorities over the right step to recognize the flag of historical and cultural value? At least, would not be repeated out of place for the authorities of the situation as it was at the funeral Bykov. "
Astapovich"If the Ministry of Culture recognized the white-red-white flag of historical and cultural value, the mode of this would not fall and would not tolerate one iota. Simply style would increase state power. At the same time I can not agree with your wording "undefined status." Yes, I remember a presidential decree number 2, passed in 1997, prohibiting the use of unregistered symbols. But white-red-white color is on the symbolism of official organizations — and in behalf of the Belarusian Language Society Skoriny and Byelorussian Exarchate Russian Orthodox Church. Since the implementation of these color combinations are not prohibited by law. "
Scoble"Last week our neighbor Lithuania Russian equated to Nazi signs and forbade and five-pointed star, and the anthems of the USSR and the Lithuanian SSR. How do you feel about this step Lithuanian authorities?"
Astapovich"Very positive. I believe that all social and political prepyadstviya which are in Russia and in Belarus, I mean the restriction of the democrati
c field, they are connected with the fact that at the time was not held crimes trial of communism.
Similar to that which took place in Nuremberg on the atrocities of Nazism. Lithuania has made a very loyal, very courageous and very appropriate step. After reddish brown plague and plague — two phenomena that resist normal human being, human morality and generally normal to the public system. "
Scoble"Lithuania is prohibited to reproduce five-pointed star. Imagine for a moment that a similar decision was made for us. Example, some newspaper prints photo Heroes of Socialist Labor — poets Maxim Tank or Petrus Brovki, while their chest-Russian five-pointed star. What then — fine paper? Or not overdone here our neighbors healthy measure? "
Astapovich"One thing — prohibit the use of signs during socio-political campaigns. And second — the study of history. Germany goes very many socio-political literature, where the same picture of the Nazi leaders, the German generals with Nazi symbols, etc. A Nazi symbols is prohibited in Germany. And no problems there is not. Because, again, it is one thing — the introduction of symbols for political purposes, and the second thing — historical analysis. "
Scoble"Let’s talk about another bukovku. During setting in the village Drazhna Staradarozhchyny on the cross, which, incidentally, belongs to your community, already convicted three people — Siuchyk, Victor and Leonid Hursik Akalovich. A cross itself excavated and taken to the village Zaluzha where is the local church. Let’s listen to the abbot of the church father of Alexander. "
Father Alexander"The cross can not belong to the society, as it — a sign of Christianity. Orthodox Cross, and Belarus has only one Orthodox church, which belongs to the Metropolitan Patriarchate. Everything that makes" Mummers "Tipo priest, it’s all illegal. All the same cross — this is our sign and we did not throw it, do not raspiluem. It is in our temporary storage. What to do with it — will be resolved in the diocese. "
Astapovich"I’ve been ready to argue with Pope Alexander. So, as a sign of the cross belongs to all Christians. But the cross raised in Drazhna — is the definition of real object made for human means.
Russian Orthodox Church in Belarus no relationship to this cross had not and has not. Father Alexander says that drazhnenski consecrated cross some "fancy dress". And in fact consecrated his representative Belarusian Autocephalous Orthodox Church. Where his father, Alexander will find written in the Gospel rule: who should determine whether a person can be a priest or not? In general, you can not monopolize the right to spiritual work with people. "
Scoble"The church is hiding on its composition cross erected in memory of the victims of the war … The Church is silent watching as state znevazhaetstsa white-red-white flag, which is the emblem of the resurrection of Jesus Christ Church … Why not protect your signs?"
Astapovich"The Russian Orthodox Church was formed back in the Russian Empire as a municipal ideological structure. And now, although the church formally split from the country, it continues to be such a structure. Figuratively speaking, the Orthodox Church has not increased the number of those pants in public walked in Russian Empire. She and emerging on the ground states of the former Soviet Union continues to serve the ideas of being Russian, Russian statehood, Russian great power. And because it is clear that white-red-white flag, which symbolizes the shroud of Jesus Christ, as a municipal sign-independent Belarus Church annoying. So as orthodox church, in my opinion, is now one hundred percent Russian Institute on areas of Belarus. " Tags: white-red-white flag, Astapovich